I'm in a conflict relationship!? (IEI + LSE)

[heavenlytuna]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

[Bethanyclaire]

http://www.socionics.com/articles/thestrength.htm

I/O referred to conflict types as being more divergent than conflicting in nature

i can picture IEI getting together with LSE, it’s like an alternative version of a EIE/IEI..

[heavenlytuna]

Hmm, that same website has another link on conflicting relationships which says:

'Conflicting relations have the worst compatibility between partners among all other relations....

...attempts to continue pushing their relationship any further will soon provoke an open conflict between the partners.....With every conflict these relations become worse and worse.'

http://www.socionics.com/rel/cnf.htm

[Bethanyclaire]

Hmm, that same website has another link on conflicting relationships which says:

'Conflicting relations have the worst compatibility between partners among all other relations....

...attempts to continue pushing their relationship any further will soon provoke an open conflict between the partners.....With every conflict these relations become worse and worse.'

http://www.socionics.com/rel/cnf.htm

Up to you what to believe..point is, not all conflict relationships are as bad as others

if you are in a conflict relationship you might find the info helpful

[Alonzo]

I'd say that there is a greater likelihood someone is mistyped than you actually being in a conflict relationship, and especially if you've been together for a while.

[BrainlessSquid]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

The way you describe each other points to IEE - SLI duality but I can be wrong
You can test a few other NF ST combinations, which seems like the likely scenario

Also if both of you do this test here https://openpsychometrics.org/tests/O4TS/
I can say what"s more likely your true types

[Sol]

typing theme with a video for you and another human. then IR can be supposed

to make bad is possibly with any IR. to make good with bad IR - this needs to be a hero

> Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

A human looks interesting and good on surface. In closer dealing you'll understand that the difference is more than you expected. To wrong side which is hard to accept.
One of noticable traits - quickly feeling tired in communications. You just talk, but you'll want to rest from such. Also possible: feeling higher anxiety, attention concentration becomes harder, reducing of self acceptance and self assurance, reducing feeling optimism - what relates to general neurotisation symptoms and often depressive symptoms.

There exist what to improve in relations, as both have strong functions close to same as duals. Both need to accept that other human has other rules of life, - values which you think as not motivating for you. If you'll care in any human's superid region - this should improve his state the most. Conflictors understand what other one wants - they more don't want to do that, as they think "not like that".
LSE may think - I'll give her more of Se materia, but after she'll show me more of Fi sympathy and compassion. Alike this works good in duality as people by own wish express 1-2 functions and this goes to superid of 2nd human. For conflictor you need to express the same 7-8 functions - which are strong, but not valued - you don't want to express them much. But for conflictor - it's what he needs and wants.
Hypothetically if both will change own style of mutual caring to good accent on 7-8 functions - conflictors IR may allow to feel good for both.
In a pair exists general high compassion, so to do what other one needs and wants - is appropriate. To do this for conflictor just looks as wrong, from the point of your type values. But it only looks, - it's distortion of perception of Jung type accentuation. Where duals establish good relations having maximum initial predisposition for this. To make good relations with a conflictor may need changes from initial tastes of both.
Besides perceiving demans of other human as "wrong", you get higher tiring and other higher neurotism, some behavior of conflictor may look as not pleasant and appropriate. Behavior needs be adopted to tastes of a conflictor in a pair too. Neurotism possibly will be reduced when mutual support in superid will become better.

It's a theory. There is no proved practice how to overcome problems of bad IR to get relations where both feel good, perceive relations as good. Needs additional work and efforts, for sure. May be may help.
In many cases, the optimum way would be to find someone easier.

[heavenlytuna]

The way you describe each other points to IEE - SLI duality but I can be wrong
You can test a few other NF ST combinations, which seems like the likely scenario

Also if both of you do this test here https://openpsychometrics.org/tests/O4TS/
I can say what"s more likely your true types

Okay thanks, I got overwhelmingly Melancholic as the highest, Phleg & Sang in the middle and Choleric as very low.

He got a balanced result with Melancholic, Choleric and Phlegmatic all at 12 and Sanguine shortly behind.

[Sol]

We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

The only good way to be assured in own type is to identify types of >10 well-known people and to check your expected IR effects fit with them. In other case the chance of a mistake is high.

> Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

It's possibly to keep bad IR pair to end of life. But as I've described above - there exist serious problems to have no conflicts. Low level of emotional and behavior problems in long pair is not about bad IR.
So rather more possibly other types, which with higher chance differ not much and not bad IR. Examples: ISTJ - INFP, ESTJ - ENFP, ESTJ - INFJ, etc.

> I got overwhelmingly Melancholic as the highest, Phleg & Sang in the middle and Choleric as very low.

It's not about Jung types and no of test itself is absolute.
There is Gulenko's hypothesis about Galen's 4 temperaments and Jung types link: melancholic - IP, phleg - IJ, sang - EP, choleric - EJ.
It's not a part of Socionics. There is nothing to think about strict link between different typologies - at best there can be some correlation.

The way you describe each other points to IEE - SLI duality

The info to say types is not enough. The said points on possible J / P difference.
"He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized."

[heavenlytuna]

I just find it hard to see us as any other types. I sometimes consider EII-Ne for myself but IEI seems a slightly better fit. He seems to have such high Te as well.

[BrainlessSquid]

Okay thanks, I got overwhelmingly Melancholic as the highest, Phleg & Sang in the middle and Choleric as very low.

He got a balanced result with Melancholic, Choleric and Phlegmatic all at 12 and Sanguine shortly behind.

Your temperament is not compatible with IEI, and points to EII instead. His temperament is harder to analyze but it can work for LSE, which is choleric dominant and Melancholic secondary.

So you're probably EII-LSE duality but of course I don't have sufficient data.

[Sol]

I just find it hard to see us as any other types.

The only good data today to be assured in own type is with taking into account IR with good known people, besides peoples common behavior fiting to theory.
The used now methods are very speculative - the same data may lead to different opinions. The approach which includes IR makes this problem lesser by enlarging data and establishing complex links in it. This makes the possibility to accidentally see good fiting to theory with a mistake in own type as rather small.
Other ways leave significant chance on a mistake - tens %. There are many people who mistake in own types, often are mistakes in types of other people. The common typing match is ~20%, - what means the common accuracy 40%. That you know yourself and someone good still leaves significant chances for mistakes. Those chances are seriously become lesser with the recommended approach.
It's not so hard to suppose types of people which you know good - by common behavior, tests, your intuitive impressions from their nonverbal behavior. Needs to know basic theory (read Filatova's book in English) and to think for some monthes. During this process you also train typing skills and better understand what are Jung types with examples near you.

> I sometimes consider EII-Ne for myself but IEI seems a slightly better fit. He seems to have such high Te as well.

T types have good both Te / Ti.

The mistake can be in one human's type or in both. To be correct in types of both is lesser chance than in a type of a single human. If to take 40% as common accuracy, then for 2 people it would be 40*40 = 20%.
The described situation does not look as conflicting IR, where what people are feeling I've tried to explain. The mistake in types is possible and would explain. For example, ISTJ + INFP / ESTJ + ENFP = good IR, - just 1 trait for 1 of 2 humans and you get totally different IR situation.

[Beautiful sky]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

Yes you are in conflict relationship and no conflict relationship aren’t the worst relationships nor are they apparently conflicting just annoying as can be lol

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Sex with conflictor is probably really hot if you don't expect too much or you don't think u will cuddle afterwards and talk deeply about your feelings and values. Not a good idea. But that isn't really good to do with my dual either usually unless they are particularly evolved or had help with their Fi polr growing up because Fi polr sucks that way lol. And truthfully throat fucking me in the right way is mostly how you get me in touch with my feelings anyway, so no hate. /winks at Leo.

Dunno there are LSEs that I get along with. I'm not sure about "romantically" but that is kinda meh to me regardless of type. I've found I get along a lot better with the Si subtype than the Te one, I think.

People in the typology community can use type as an excuse too much when more than often type isn't the problem and people are just using it as an excuse to be a selfish asshole in some way or another.

[End]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

If you know anything about me and what I've been harping on about constantly you already know what's coming and if you know that and stubbornly refuse to acknowledge it than I got nothing for ya. I mean hell I can easily imagine how I could both meet, fall in love with, marry, have kids, and be so happy I'd think I met my soulmate as I speak of an ESE I initially thought was an SEE!

Attachment. Theory. Look. It. Up. Grok it in your head and act on it as it is literally the answer to how and why all your interpersonal relationships either worked out great or you got fucked up the arse over and over for (from your perspective) no gosh darn good reason!

Take it from an ILI's ILI (I mean seriously every test I take from every corner of the net I get labled such in one form or another). Attachment is the key determining factor in whether or not a relationship will work out well for both involved. This goes for all the chips if we're talking about marriage/romance!

[Bethanyclaire]

If you are really not sure where to start, I would buy Gulenko’s book. It’s not that bad. From
what I recall it offers suggestions on how to improve all ITR.

[Lycantrope]

Are you sure you're not LSI-EIE duals?

[youfloweryourfeast]

It’s not that bad for me depending on the place it is. If there’s not way to get away then you have to find a way to be by yourself 4 some times. You kinda have to stay on your toes to prevent conflict which can be distesssinfg.
IMG_9012.jpegI actually read conflict relations can cause these symptoms psychomatic disorders and I experience this since I have conflict irl at school c superego can a little asl well to conflict. I actually have severe breathing problems and emotional issues but I’ve realized now what relations to stay away from. I’ve actually decided that I’m not gonna go to college due to problems with the relations and conflicts that have..socionc kinda help. Since beta is the most common type. Most of my teacher have been LSIs how ever, not my conflict. These relations (conflict)also caused me to project it onto others where I had breakdowns.
there was one SLE-ti lady at a summer camp it caused me severe mental issues and it was due to it being outdoors and my mother found out lady that they weren’t even liscensed to run it.

[DogOfDanger]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

My advice would be to not take socionics or MBTI so seriously that you trust it over your real life experience or allow it to sabotage your relationships. There are actually alot of flaws in both socionics and MBTI, some of which aren't apparent until you study the systems more deeply.

[The Reality Denialist]

I would guess this includes mistypings. This sort of chemistry between people will burn each other pretty soon and you'd both find a great relief once it ends. In any case don't use socionics if you do not understand the whole socion ( close to 99 % of people are in this category).

[BrainlessSquid]

I identify as IEI and my partner of 5 years is LSE. We've both taken several tests and looked at the functions and we're fairly sure of our types.

We are surprised to learn our relationship is supposed to be one of conflict. Since we've had a relatively conflict-free relationship over the years, could we be wrong about our types? Or can conflict relationships survive if both are more 'evolved' for lack of a better word?

We are opposites in a lot of ways. He's a systematic, routine, "type A" whereas I'm a bit more go-with-the-flow, scatterbrained and disorganized. Overall this hasn't been a huge problem as we have an understanding of our strengths and weaknesses and have learned to work around each other in that respect. He appreciates that I bring more 'whimsy' in to the relationship and I'm grateful for the structure and support he offers.

We do clash on occasion over small things like me leaving my clothes all over the floor and him being slightly insistent on the 'correct way' of doing things. But it never leads to a big drawn out argument and communication has always been very easy. Our values are similar - both politically left (although he is much more interested in politics than me), both animal lovers, community-minded and we share the same friendship circle. I'd also say that we're generally easy-going in our social lives and with each other, but are both very hard on ourselves as individuals and are perfectionist in our own rights.

Does anyone have more information on how conflict relationships can work?

I doubt very much that a conflict relationship would be conflict-free over the YEARS. That's just nonsense.
Even duals have conflicts.
I'd say you can expect duality > conflict in this case. I'm not implying anything, only talking probabilities.

[End]

It’s not that bad for me depending on the place it is. If there’s not way to get away then you have to find a way to be by yourself 4 some times. You kinda have to stay on your toes to prevent conflict which can be distesssinfg.
IMG_9012.jpegI actually read conflict relations can cause these symptoms psychomatic disorders and I experience this since I have conflict irl at school c superego can a little asl well to conflict. I actually have severe breathing problems and emotional issues but I’ve realized now what relations to stay away from. I’ve actually decided that I’m not gonna go to college due to problems with the relations and conflicts that have..socionc kinda help. Since beta is the most common type. Most of my teacher have been LSIs how ever, not my conflict. These relations (conflict)also caused me to project it onto others where I had breakdowns.
there was one SLE-ti lady at a summer camp it caused me severe mental issues and it was due to it being outdoors and my mother found out lady that they weren’t even liscensed to run it.

No type is most common. It really does depend on where you are in history and the globe. That you project your conflicts onto others is also not all that unusual. Insecurely attached people tend to project their own "sins" onto others because, well, it's a damnably effective tactic that often nets you a gain no matter what happens afterwards.

If you've never heard of the likes of Saul Alinsky or Edward Bernays I'd say you ought to look them up and read their works. Not as a recommendation as to what you ought to do but rather as an inoculation against such types of people and the tactics they employ. Hell it goes back farther than you may think. Many type Niccolo Machiavelli as an ILI/INTJ because of his most well known work "The Prince". That one ensured the term "Old Nick" became a synonym for Satan himself.

He didn't want that. That much is obvious. But in order to counter the Satanic Tyrant you must first be able to paint the picture of one in a way even the most idiotic ESE with a hard on for perfect social harmony will be able to grasp. Once you know how such people think and operate you can effectively spot and counter them. Forewarned is Forearmed as they say.

[youfloweryourfeast]

I never said one type is the most common. I just agree that beta is and most social gatherings and public institutions are beta. I have friends from other quadras I just don't meet them in big places and gatherings ever.
My father is LSE and ni polr and we looked up summer camps for me and because he's ti ignoring he did no research on what it was actually gonna be like. I also was naive then and thought it'd be a great idea, but now I have to be extremely wary of the places I go because I'm not really meant for them.
I've been stuck in a lot of somewhat bad institutions and I had one ILE friend but who she was able to get in a nice school and stay there.. It because I'd often not attend school due to health issues that randomly I'd get and ignore my work. Honestly I think I have missed too many days of school at this point to graduate but my parents tend to put me in this places and I have no income to leave.

[youfloweryourfeast]

Nvm I don’t think ti ignoring has anything to do exactly with it but idk

[Simple]

.

[Braingel]

You guys should both learn enneagram and undo your own ego biases as best as can, which will take a long time of doing, perhaps even a lifetime to reduce it to mostly nothing.. Most relationships can work well when you aren’t operating from an ego, it makes even less comparable functions more easy to tolerate or have patience with.

[Braingel]

Most of the ITR dynamics are honestly written from average health enneagram POV.. It doesn’t at all capture healthy or unhealthy. Two unhealthy duals won’t even be as conducive, may even stimulate one another for worse.. Same with activity, which I can observe in my mother and father.

[BrainlessSquid]

You guys should both learn enneagram and undo your own ego biases as best as can, which will take a long time of doing, perhaps even a lifetime to reduce it to mostly nothing.. Most relationships can work well when you aren’t operating from an ego, it makes even less comparable functions more easy to tolerate or have patience with.

I agree. Ego is the enemy. Generally speaking, anyone can make it work if they let their ego's aside. Beyond type, there's a human being.

[youfloweryourfeast]

I think enneagram can impact relationships but it's not realistic when it comes to lifestyle and values. I'd prefer my dual even if their enneagram is not compatible with mine over conflict for real life situations, or semi duality.
I agree they are human beings like everyone else but there are no ego biases going on here, it's simply compatibility.

[youfloweryourfeast]

I typed a lot of people and been in a lot of messed up places. And it's for my own safety and well-being to know what people to avoid because I was easily manipulated, and taken advantage of in the past. I'd rather be wary than naive.
It's not a bias because it's not unreasonable judgment as I gave examples in my post. These things are real life situations and traumatic experiences I've been in.

[Braingel]

I think enneagram can impact relationships but it's not realistic when it comes to lifestyle and values. I'd prefer my dual even if their enneagram is not compatible with mine over conflict for real life situations, or semi duality.
I agree they are human beings like everyone else but there are no ego biases going on here, it's simply compatibility.

You would prefer your dual or semi dual, but the point is that with no ego there, you can get on with anyone decently. I mean, even socionics is ego; ego blocks with functions.

[youfloweryourfeast]

Yeah I do try to adapt to people as best as I can generally, which I agree people can do and it's easier once you are older. I do think the fixation on socionics can sometimes have a negative impact, though it has also helped me understand people better. Having people around in your opposite quadra can be stressful though even if there is one guy who's my semi dual, he can't really help me. I have typed him LIE but I suspect he could be ESI maybe, idk.
Since SLEs are your dual you probably wouldn't have as such a negative perspective as I once did, but with LSEs and delta sts, even though I like them for help in some realms of my life, I can also see many of their mishaps and faults(their low ni and poor fi), which I think you could likely see with beta sts- their faults.

[Braingel]

Yeah I do try to adapt to people as best as I can generally, which I agree people can do and it's easier once you are older. I do think the fixation on socionics can sometimes have a negative impact, though it has also helped me understand people better.
Since SLEs are your dual you probably wouldn't have as such a negative perspective as I once did, but with LSEs and delta sts, even though I like them for help in some realms of my life, I can also see many of their mishaps and faults(their low ni and poor fi), which I think you could likely see with beta sts- their faults.

Good to see that someone else types me IEI.. I have received enough EIE typings on this site and it isn’t even what I am.. And then got a dubious SEE typing that makes no sense, but I may be a G IEI who has type shifted into SEE functions, I suppose..

[Braingel]

I’m pretty tired of people typing me an extrovert just because I have a severe case of complex PTSD, people misreading autism writing a lot and bluntness, and also, because people don’t know enough about shadowed states and grips, primarily because people don’t know much Jung, and because socionics had no such theory. Also just not knowing about autism enough to begin with, and how it exacerbates my complex ptsd times ten, because of inherent executive capacity deficits.

I figured if you were a friend of vewwy/repent though, you’d probably see me more accurately.. I had a hunch..

Generally though, it takes talking to me via voice and intense discord 1-1 conversations to understand I’m introverted..

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...8010d6d50c51c&

and people don’t look at my presentation very holistically, with only rare exceptions as this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...781cc09b675c0&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...746c2dbcd90c3&

(Got bullied with eie typings and other things that are worse than typology-related)..
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...746c2dbcd90c3&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7075efa33beeb&


People don’t even understand my behavior and use their own confirmation bias and halo effect to try entrap me into eie or to just an extrovert..

[Braingel]

Sometimes it just feels like people don’t even care how such a thing overtime becomes just another added trauma and trauma stressor, because they don’t even know my background or enough about autism, and how with my set of circumstances and pathology, overtime, it becomes a trauma trigger to be repeatedly invalidated, and they don’t even realize they’re wrong.

People would just say leave typology communities. I have tried a lot to.. But being socially inept and not having good social skills (one of many reasons extroversion is a fucking joke for me, but this is one of the more superficial reasons, where it’s just a trait, doesn’t have do with where my inherent focus is directly), it is very hard to engage in other places, and especially with my autistic obsessive interests..

In both the traditional definitions of losing energy from engaging and focusing outward and lacking charisma and charm, and of jungian lack forward focus in how I default process info.. I am a clear as day introvert.. Yes, I care a lot of how I am viewed. This has do with my childhood trauma and abuse, and how it shaped me into an image core in the enneagram— never being received well, always criticized, dismissed of my internal world, people not seeing or valuing me, being called names like a “worthless piece of shit” by my father and “stupid girl”, having my internal perceptions and direct experiences invalidated and gaslit. Yeah, of course I would become an image core.. Doesn't make me extroverted.

Aside from having abusive parents that shaped me as this, and being bullied, you can say my introversion had made me be able to less persuade and influence others. EIE is supposed to be this master persuader, and an SEE would convince others via their friends and social status, and it is way more able to climb than an eie, because not only does it have 4D Fe, but Se.. It would climb and convince. I lack all of this. If people even fucking pay attention, I am always stuck unable to convince anyone…. I am stuck and fixated— very unlike an EP type or a 4D Ne type, more like an ignoring Ne type or an IJ.. Stuck and fixated on things, and not focusing much on much else, other than what I have internalized. There are numerous reasons why I believe autism is an inherently introverted disorder, when you don’t just have autistic traits that you see in some extroverts, like sensory issues, or just awkwardness..

If people paid any remote attention to the content of my words, and not the substance of merely writing a lot and endlessly, you’d fucking see it all has do with things concerning myself. It’s not Fe social dynamics outside of me and of others’ moods and hierarchies and shit, nor is it of my physical surroundings and of what is around me… ( @qaz00 .. Whuch is what Se is). It’s literally just endless drivel about my own self.. Even ESI would be a better typing for me, but I don’t fit its renin, IJ organization, or 4D Si… Or Te seeking. How can a person who literally only talks about their own emotions, internal fantasies, and of things that have impacted them and how THEY feel about it, even be an extrovert… That is quite literally, the polar opposite of an extroversive focus.

For me to be an ESI, I’d have to notice a lot more sensations in myself, have good willpower and action, and would be very gifted in physical detail recognition and surrounding awareness, whereas I am so detached from that shit, I run into walls and almost cars, trip all the time, don’t notice messes in front of me, have almost caught things on fire, can’t cook or drive because of this, and often have knotted hair or things on my body I’m not aware of. I’ve also almost blinded myself with a safety pin, not aware I had one in my hand, and it hit my face, near my eye and nose where they meet.

[youfloweryourfeast]

Unfortunately, their Ni is not that strong so it will be hard for them to look in depth; not that they can't, but they tend to see things as what is in their mind. Along with disengagement due to low Fi.

I was reading some ESI descriptions and well, in Augusta's Psychiatric Descriptions they are described as a "target" or "scapegoat" and in youth are often bullied, but never fight back, where as LSIs don't have to worry about this much. ESIs are impressionable like most Fi bases are but EIIs are often far more due to the forgiveness that we hold within our hearts, and being fi+ and that the harm and bullying is never forgotten. I do see some commonalities interestingly to ESIs and IEIs due to 4d FI and 4d NI and being more vulnerable/targets. ESIs however are often forced to engage in the world more and tend to be forced into things.

And well SEEs have 4d Fe and 2D Te like you said so this makes them very different.

https://augustaproject.wordpress.com...-descriptions/

I agree that Ni is linked to autism but not always, how ever I think their are different factors that could create autism- For instance I being ne creative and having stronger ni than my IEE friend I would say I am prone to fixating a bit more. (Also being a withdrawn enneagram)

[Braingel]

Unfortunately, their Ni is not that strong so it will be hard for them to look in depth; not that they can't, but they tend to see things as what is in their mind. Along with disengagement due to low Fe.

I was reading some ESI descriptions and well, in Augusta's Psychiatric Descriptions they are described as a "target" or "scapegoat" and in youth are often bullied, but never fight back, where as LSIs don't have to worry about this much. ESIs are impressionable like most Fi bases are but EIIs are often far more due to the forgiveness that we hold within our hearts, and being fi+ and that the harm and bullying is never forgotten. I do see some commonalities interestingly to ESIs and IEIs due to 4d FI and 4d NI and being more vulnerable/targets. ESIs however are often forced to engage in the world more and likely have to study in school.

And well SEEs have 4d Fe and 2D Te like you said so this makes them rather different

https://augustaproject.wordpress.com...-descriptions/

I agree that Ni is linked to autism but not always, how ever I think their are different factors that could create autism- For instance I being ne creative and having stronger ni than my IEE friend I would say I am prone to fixating a bit more.

Yes, I was thinking that the vast majority who type me as an eie or extrovert are sensors, focusing too much on the surface and not my innermost dynamics. Though, I’ve never had an SLE who didn’t recognize me as their dual from any typology setting, with interacting directly, and even from my content..

[Braingel]

I believe Amanda Todd was a good example of an esi

[chriscorey]

I’m pretty tired of people typing me an extrovert just because I have a severe case of complex PTSD, people misreading autism writing a lot and bluntness, and also, because people don’t know enough about shadowed states and grips, primarily because people don’t know much Jung, and because socionics had no such theory. Also just not knowing about autism enough to begin with, and how it exacerbates my complex ptsd times ten, because of inherent executive capacity deficits.

I figured if you were a friend of vewwy/repent though, you’d probably see me more accurately.. I had a hunch..

Generally though, it takes talking to me via voice and intense discord 1-1 conversations to understand I’m introverted..

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...8010d6d50c51c&

and people don’t look at my presentation very holistically, with only rare exceptions as this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...781cc09b675c0&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...746c2dbcd90c3&

(Got bullied with eie typings and other things that are worse than typology-related)..
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...746c2dbcd90c3&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7075efa33beeb&


People don’t even understand my behavior and use their own confirmation bias and halo effect to try entrap me into eie or to just an extrovert..

anyone who types you extrovert is a complete idiot. I don't know why you entertain their lunacy.

[Lord Pixel]

If you know anything about me and what I've been harping on about constantly you already know what's coming and if you know that and stubbornly refuse to acknowledge it than I got nothing for ya. I mean hell I can easily imagine how I could both meet, fall in love with, marry, have kids, and be so happy I'd think I met my soulmate as I speak of an ESE I initially thought was an SEE!

Attachment. Theory. Look. It. Up. Grok it in your head and act on it as it is literally the answer to how and why all your interpersonal relationships either worked out great or you got fucked up the arse over and over for (from your perspective) no gosh darn good reason!

Take it from an ILI's ILI (I mean seriously every test I take from every corner of the net I get labled such in one form or another). Attachment is the key determining factor in whether or not a relationship will work out well for both involved. This goes for all the chips if we're talking about marriage/romance!

Man this was definitively amusing to read. lol. But look, I've looked at the theory and it sounds nice and all but nothing clicked like socionics and other type theories did. It sounded fine enough tho, I just don't see the link you are seeing. Mostly what I saw was, if you aren't secure attachment you are screwed.