IEIs/INFps are you fickle?
Generally overall I tend to like most people.... so if I'm asked for my overall view on a person it's usually positive.
However with certain individuals (ok quite a few) my feelings can swing greatly from being really pissed off, angry and frustrated one day to thinking a person is super great the next.
This confuses my friends as they often comment "I thought you hated him/her!?!?". They tell me I'm fickle. Are you?
My emotions and overall feeling for people can swing around because I can have a point of view, they do someting else which changes it, then over time the memory fades, something else happens, etc.
This means my appreciation of people can be more reactive than static. I try not to show it much though, and to act more consistently. Otherwise it does look fickle and shallow.
Last edited by GuavaDrunk; 07-21-2011 at 11:22 PM. Reason: precision
Reason is a whore.
I have a hard time accepting other people's energy unless it's just as shy as mine (which is rare) or outgoing/assertive in a way that complements me and doesn't get on my nerves. (also rare) I try to be more friendly with people lately, and it feels good to be more social in real life (a death in the family is bringing everybody closer together)... but I've always been sensitive as to how my subjective energy meshes/clashes with other people's.
YupOriginally Posted by GuavaDrunk
hmmm... maybe stress and hormones are also a contributing factor.
Sorry to hear you have had sad news
I wish i could be allowed to be shy. To survive socially and at work i feel I need to fight against my natural tendancies all of the time. On the plus side at least I get to be me some weekends.
Introverts will be extinct soon anyway. With so many rewards for extroverted activities evolution will weed us out. ESTp's, ESTj's and ENTj's will rule the world.
Im not trying to tell you what your feelings are and I dont have enough details here but...this could just be because you have different emotions for them at once. Happens to me. Ill think "this person does have this and that quality, but hes still a dick to people". You probably just see different aspects of the person, which you have different emotions for.
Join my Enneagram Discord: https://discord.gg/ND4jCAcs
Pretty much. Happens even more when I'm stressed. Is even more noticeable in some cases than others. Like, if there's someone I absolutely can't stand most of the time, I'll probably treat them the same way usually. However I have sort of an obvious love-hate thing going on with my LSI younger brother. Something he can just be such a little shit, but in general we get along really well. I remember feeling this a lot about my classmates and my closest childhood friend who was either SEE or SLE. He was such an abusive, manipulative jerk (think Tony from Skins UK) but everyone ate it up. String of hot ESE and SEE girlfriends, decided to ruin their lives when he felt insecure about the relationship and move on to another just like her. Only person in our entire friends group who didn't approve was an LII, and everyone else just thought I was a bitch, I suppose.
Sometimes I think my decision-making can seem a little fickle. It's difficult for me to actually make Te-related decisions, like where to market myself, when to settle financial matters and the like. I've always had a lot of luck in that area though, so as horrible as doing that stuff feels, I manage to "expect the best" and go forward. Often I "just know" when things are going to work out so I do them, which gives Rationals the idea that I'm completely devoid of common sense but also very lucky.
Okay, hope that all made sense more or less. Fuzzy brain after getting up from a nap.
SOOO fickle... wait.. let me consider this... maybe i'm not...
;p
EDIT:
I'm made fun of in my family often for my fickle-ness. I am actually very fickle, but I always say it's because that's how I'm receiving life. I communicate what I receive, which is an ever-changing circumstance and juncture.
"If you can find out little melodies for yourself on the piano it is all very well. But if they come of themselves when you are not at the piano, then you have still greater reason to rejoice; for then the inner sense of music is astir in you. The fingers must make what the head wills, not vice versa."- Robert Schumann
I assume the best of people and even if they've been idiots, I keep an open mind. Is that "fickle" though, or optimistic or what? I think I've never met a person I couldn't like. Not to say that I'd want to be close to everyone, but I see value.
When I was 12 or 13 I knew this kid who was troubled--he had spent some time in juvenile prison (or whatever it's called) and I remember clearly seeing such a ball full of energy in him and thinking that he could change the world if he could harness it in the right direction and while everyone else called him trouble, I had a strong feeling of hope regarding him. I don't even know what happened to him. I think he was transferred to another foster home and left the area.
p.s. when I look back on that kid, I realize he was SLE. lol
IEI-Fe 4w3
aw. damnit i wish i was more like this ^.... or that everyone had a dual...I assume the best of people and even if they've been idiots, I keep an open mind. Is that "fickle" though, or optimistic or what? I think I've never met a person I couldn't like. Not to say that I'd want to be close to everyone, but I see value.
When I was 12 or 13 I knew this kid who was troubled--he had spent some time in juvenile prison (or whatever it's called) and I remember clearly seeing such a ball full of energy in him and thinking that he could change the world if he could harness it in the right direction and while everyone else called him trouble, I had a strong feeling of hope regarding him. I don't even know what happened to him. I think he was transferred to another foster home and left the area.
p.s. when I look back on that kid, I realize he was SLE. lol
I think I was a lot more judgmental of people in general when I was younger. This has changed over the past 5-10 years I'd say.But I do remember that one kid, who I did truly like and think the best of. Maybe it's more type-related than not. I mean, perhaps one is more naturally wired to be forgiving of one's duals, without even realizing this. hmm.
IEI-Fe 4w3
i'm like this too. i don't really consider myself "fickle" - it's just that i may react differently to a person at different times based on whatever circumstances - like @Typhon said, i have different emotions for different aspects of people.
i understand people are flawed, and that people don't always get along, and that despite these things, they also have good qualities. i think that is one reason i don't usually feel lasting resentment towards people, because i have a hard time forgetting their good qualities, especially in the long run.
i would rather be friendly and display goodwill when dealing with others - i think i naturally do this. holding grudges doesn't really go along with that.
Interesting! That swinging has been mentioned under the enneagram sexual 4 subtype. But as sexual second I don't relate to that (and my sexual is super prominent). Overall I have a very total picture of someone so my moods are pretty consistent, I always look for what there is to like in people so it's overall positive.
I can see how how that swinging would occur - for my own life I have family members who are very emotional - and who I can really enjoy being with or feel loved by and then who, through their own stressors and depressants, just act like dicks. Why do you think it is that you swing?
The IEI's I know in real life (well the two for sure) are VERY swingy, one probably has histrionic personality disorder or something along those lines though. They are both quite critical, sensitive and can develop strong dislikes of people and their behavior (even when it doesn't negatively effect them).
Last edited by betterthan; 05-30-2013 at 10:14 PM.
IEI, sp/sx 4w3.
That story gave me shivers lol! ^_^. It's very cool how you see the worldI assume the best of people and even if they've been idiots, I keep an open mind. Is that "fickle" though, or optimistic or what? I think I've never met a person I couldn't like. Not to say that I'd want to be close to everyone, but I see value.
When I was 12 or 13 I knew this kid who was troubled--he had spent some time in juvenile prison (or whatever it's called) and I remember clearly seeing such a ball full of energy in him and thinking that he could change the world if he could harness it in the right direction and while everyone else called him trouble, I had a strong feeling of hope regarding him. I don't even know what happened to him. I think he was transferred to another foster home and left the area.
p.s. when I look back on that kid, I realize he was SLE. lol
IEI, sp/sx 4w3.
My cousin's oldest daughter (7) is INFp. Today we had a bridal shower and this kiddo was eating cream puffs; she split it open and started to lick the cream inside. My family members, who were sitting around the table, next to her, noticed her and started to make fun of her and the way she ate the cream; she was getting it on her upper lip, chin, nose tip and began to lick it off. She went from fun and entertaining herself to suddenly crying. Had I not known Socionics, I would never have reacted as I did in that very moment. I grabbed her, sat her on my lap and wiped her silent tears with my hands, saying "bales [this word is not translatable into English, it just mean my precious child] don't cry." I told everyone in silent, cold look "don't say anything more to her." These adults genuinely felt bad for what they were saying; they were hoping she would take what they said lightly, but come to find out, our INFp child does not like being made fun of. She had me help her with a painting project and when I was leaving, she ran up to me, hugged me and said "thank you for cheering me up."
I did nothing except wipe her tears, call her "bales," and help her paint. I said nothing funny or fun to her. I understand the interaction between Beta LSI and IEI now. It's sweet.
-
Dual type(as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
not in the way that you define it; it drives me crazy when other people are fickle but as for myself I am mostly fickle in a romantic situation where I end up falling for someone who is bad for me and it suddenly hits that the person is great as a friend but way below my ideal as anything more than that. Generally I like everyone too but there are certain bitchy/cold/two-faced types that I instinctively hate and avoid just by taking one look at them. In that case, it takes a 180" change of someone's nature (since this is what I gauge in people) or an act of kindness (which I value enough to overlook other flaws, as opposed to "nice" which can be fake) for me to change my opinion about someone.
With good friends though I can forgive a few faults over time and "forget" what I was angry/pissed off about at least when I'm interacting with them... But I'll still remember it and be wary of them. For example if I have a friend whom I help out every single time to my detriment but doesn't help me out in return when I need it, I'll be very very disappointed, see that this friend is unreliable by nature and decide that in the future I won't go out of my way to help them out since they don't have a sense of gratitude/obligation. But I will still hang out with them and act normal.
Oops I just noticed this is an old thread. Silly me
Last edited by echan; 04-22-2013 at 01:01 AM.
hahaha, I definitely am, which is why I don't have any tattoos, even though they are so pretty.
What does this story have to do with "being fickle?" I can't imagine why you would dig up such an old post to share a completely unrelated story.My cousin's oldest daughter (7) is INFp. Today we had a bridal shower and this kiddo was eating cream puffs; she split it open and started to lick the cream inside. My family members, who were sitting around the table, next to her, noticed her and started to make fun of her and the way she ate the cream; she was getting it on her upper lip, chin, nose tip and began to lick it off. She went from fun and entertaining herself to suddenly crying. Had I not known Socionics, I would never have reacted as I did in that very moment. I grabbed her, sat her on my lap and wiped her silent tears with my hands, saying "bales [this word is not translatable into English, it just mean my precious child] don't cry." I told everyone in silent, cold look "don't say anything more to her." These adults genuinely felt bad for what they were saying; they were hoping she would take what they said lightly, but come to find out, our INFp child does not like being made fun of. She had me help her with a painting project and when I was leaving, she ran up to me, hugged me and said "thank you for cheering me up."
I did nothing except wipe her tears, call her "bales," and help her paint. I said nothing funny or fun to her. I understand the interaction between Beta LSI and IEI now. It's sweet.
When people made fun of me as a child I made fun of them right back, which was easy because they were stupid and they made easily refutable claims. I actually quite enjoyed it. I never cried unless I was physically injured.
Probably because I'm hell spawn.
To answer the original question (since I am the only real IEI responding according to Martisocioncs): no I am not fickle in any aspect of my life. In my relationships a am --perhaps-- too steadfast. It takes a *lot* for me to become upset with a person I have decided I like and I usually don't forgive once they have done something to alienate themselves from me.
Last edited by Scapegrace; 04-23-2013 at 12:33 PM.
"[Scapegrace,] I don't know how anyone can stand such a sinister and mean individual as you." - Maritsa Darmandzhyan
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I'm fickle and I'm not IEI. Not type related and nothing to do with children squeeling for attention. Derp.
No, not really. Like/dislike for me tends to remain fairly consistent. If I have decided there is a reason to dislike someone, I generally don't forget or change my judgment, although the person may not even realize that I don't like them. I tend to just avoid those I don't like, for the most part.
God, you so fickle Jet. Wanting things the way you want, how dare you! :]
Sure, lets hang out.
*Turns off phone all weekend*
Projection is ordinary. Person A projects at person B, hoping tovalidate something about person A by the response of person B. However, person B, not wanting to be an obejct of someone elses ego and guarding against existential terror constructs a personality which protects his ego and maintain a certain sense of a robust and real self that is different and separate from person A. Sadly, this robust and real self, cut off by defenses of character from the rest of the world, is quite vulnerable and fragile given that it is imaginary and propped up through external feed back. Person B is dimly aware of this and defends against it all the more, even desperately projecting his anxieties back onto person A, with the hope of shoring up his ego with salubrious validation. All of this happens without A or B acknowledging it, of course. Because to face up to it consciously is shocking, in that this is all anybody is doing or can do and it seems absurd when you realize how pathetic it is.
My friends have noted I'm hard to get in touch with, this even when I actually *want* to hang out with them. Arrange a time and pray I turn up.
Reason is a whore.
Rub some dirt in it.
I couldn't find one to put it in and didn't want to start a new one. MAYBE someone should open a Beta Lounge and sticky it.
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Just 'open' one, Maritsa. Invite all of those camouflaged IEI there for tea and biscuits as well. I'm sure there is more hiding in bush.
....why would someone sticky your account of the fact that your niece is probably a little over sensitive and your family likes to make fun of children?I couldn't find one to put it in and didn't want to start a new one. MAYBE someone should open a Beta Lounge and sticky it.
Last edited by Scapegrace; 04-24-2013 at 05:36 AM.
"[Scapegrace,] I don't know how anyone can stand such a sinister and mean individual as you." - Maritsa Darmandzhyan
Brought to you by socionix.com
I'm not fickle, but I think I might appear so.
Often I appear to have a lot of passion or enthusiasm for a thing or person, but my emotions are more related to the tide of that moment. Later, I might shrug or dismiss the same thing or person because the context is different and no longer generates the enthusiasm. I wouldn't call this fickle because my emotions were never really tied to the object or person to begin with.
This is rough for my boyfriend. He often observes me "liking" something and then tries to please me by giving me that thing later. Then he gets a blank, confused look from me.
Emotions that are actually tied to a thing or person generally develop slowly over time, and generally only slowly change. Exception is when I have developed feelings for someone based completely on elaborate projections. (This is somewhat common for me, though not intentional.) If the person then does or says something that shatters the fantasy, I can almost instantaneously drop my feelings for them...and only because I realized my attachment was not to them, but to a fantasy.
I think this trait could be found in all of the NF types. I relate to the trait in a lot of respects.
Often when a person who is in a generally good mood, rubs a bad mood on me on a particular day, I may think "Oh no! This person is dangerous! I should stay away from him/her! I suck at life!" etc...
So there is a tendency for me to make partial judgements based on one particular thing people did when they were just having a bad day. I have to notice this more.
I have and ALWAYS want to judge people and put them in a positive light because not doing so could be hurting myself in the process. I don't consider this a weakness at all, especially since people don't take advantage of me so easily and if they do, I am capable of withdrawing from them cold turkey. I consider my attitude of seeing people as good and smart, independent thinkers who have valid opinions one of my greatest strengths.
Absurd: You Ti dominants sure say things I don't really know where to put.
labtard: fml
Absurd: Hah.
This is because you have a sexual first subtype in enneagram!!
IEI, sp/sx 4w3.
i prefer to judge behavior rather than people; a generalization to an ascription of stigmatizing qualities to a person's character is only called for in a late stage of the evaluation process.
I'm not an IEI, but can relate on some level, in certain situations. I usually see the best in people, unless they do something to overstep boundaries or rub me the wrong way. I also give people many chances once they are on the friendship level with me. The point when people do or say one too many things thatchange my opinion on them is the point when it can appear to go from 0-60 to an outsider, but there is an inward process behind it. I become more mixed on people after this, but if they do something that.
My feelings on people stay pretty consistent, unless they do or say something to change them. It wouldn't be a minor thing either. There are also some types of people who I tend to clash with, and both parities are at fault in those types of situation. Even with negative first impressions, it's that way. I may be reluctant to let people in on a deep level, but I need a reason to outright dislike a person in order for me to feel that way, it isn't just a random spur of the moment thing.
xII se PoLR, 9w1-5w4-2w3 sp/so
Phlegmatic-Melancholic |RCoAI| Fascinator| Newtype-secondary| LEFVl|
#JusticeforJeb_, Water Sheep did nothing wrong, High Inquisitor Of Council of Water Sheep and Water Sheep's protector
Make things right? Who are we to decide when things are right and when they need to be fixed?
yes I'm pretty judgmental of people but at the same time try to accept everyone (when I'm not in a close relationship to them that is)
I have been called fickle
No, I just don't hold grudges and I'm not very obvious in my expression at times
That's what's called fickle
The description of the internal process for it is fascinating though
Even though they're very capable, many IEIs don't seem to probe that deeply into people in the beginning and when they actually do peer below the images, their opinions can change drastically. This delayed reaction can sometimes take a long time because they have been known to get caught in the rapture of whatever, which creates a sort of tunnel vision. I wouldn't describe the reaction as fickle because there's usually good reason although they may not voice it - they probably just didn't get the original message....
a.k.a. I/O
Relying on (sometimes optimistic) mental constructions and then having to come to terms with reality seems to be a motif, yeah, lol, and can come off fickle. Just speaking about a certain someone I know, u know.
(You'd think I'd learn to take things with a grain of salt by now. Getting there.)
I don't think "fickle" is the right word even though I have read it in some descriptions. I think EP types are more fickle. It is something else. Hard to explain but your perception is valid. Also the majority of the forum is fickle when it comes to types. I don't put my socionics type in TIM since I like the mystery. When I played around with fake types in mine people absolutely treated me differently. lol Not those who actually talk to me and know me off the forum but those who only know me from posts did pose questions to me differently. Some who never talked to me pm-ed me and others avoided me until they knew I was just messing around.Even though they're very capable, many IEIs don't seem to probe that deeply into people in the beginning and when they actually do peer below the images, their opinions can change drastically. This delayed reaction can sometimes take a long time because they have been known to get caught in the rapture of whatever, which creates a sort of tunnel vision. I wouldn't describe the reaction as fickle because there's usually good reason although they may not voice it - they probably just didn't get the original message....
a.k.a. I/O
Younger IEI can be too trusting and naive when it comes to people. Then they can go the total opposite direction after getting burned a few times too. There is a balance somewhere in between that comes with maturity and experience with all kinds of people. This can be said of any type I suppose.
I agree that IEI don't tend to hold grudges as much as other NFs.
"The introverted intuitive type, like the extraverted intuitive, has an uncanny capacity for smelling out the future, the notyet-manifest possibilities of a situation. But the intuition is directed within, hence they are primarily found among seers and prophets, poets, artists; among primitive peoples they are the shamans who convey the messages of the gods to the tribe. On a more mundane level, persons of this type tend to be mystical day-dreamers. They do not communicate well, are frequently misunderstood, lack good judgment about both themselves and others,..." Jung
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
When I read your posts like this I feel I understand more about my one time ESI best friend and on/off roommate of many years.
I know I confused her (?) at times. I get more insight into what she may have been experiencing through your posts. I know she loved me and always had my back but I wonder if she felt I was not as committed to the friendship as she was due to some of my choices. I hope she knows I was even though romantic relationships on my end didn't leave room for my friendships. I still consider my old friends friends even though I don't talk to them. If I saw them tomorrow I could probably take up right where I left off with most of them. I am not sure if they all could do the same.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
rahmyn was more honest about this than you
but feel free to keep talking behind my back anyhow
also feel free to try and get back at me for this lol I don't care
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