By focusing on himself, rather than the audience, he winds up making controversial statements that often reflect his own feelings more than those of the audience. Consequently, his actions generate publicity (often of the negative sort). Some might call it being "real" or "authentic", but intentionally or unintentionally, EIEs tend not to impact the environment with such an inward focus. I think this rules out Fe.
Now, we might consider LIE, but as you probably guessed with your typing, Kanye relies on value judgments to make decisions. Unlike Jay-Z, a Gamma NT, Kanye doesn't prioritize the logistics involved with his vision - rather, Kanye primarily cares about making an impact with art that he views as valuable. So, this rules out Te and brings us to Fi.
Concerning the productiveness - all decisive types (Gamma, Beta) tend to mobilize themselves for action preemptively. They tend to be productive people, knowing what they want with a vision of how to get it. It comes with the territory of Se and Ni.
This doesn't rule out SEE, but I think his Ni is a bit too pronounced for that.
I thought IEI or LIE from the Jimmy farron interview, could be wrong though.
>Why do his actions generate publicity?
How the public receives him determines the amount of publicity he generates, but I take it that's not the angle you want to get at here.
The bottom line: extraverted functions first and foremost concern information about the object. The focus is objective. So when you give input to the extraverted function of an extravert, the output will largely be shaped according to what the individual sees as "objective" information. For example, when an Fe lead has a positive relationship with a group, they will give feedback in a way that complements the emotional atmosphere as they interpret it. Fe leads are the kinds of people who, when they want beneficial results for their team, they will make the environment positive enough for a project to push forward. Even the negativistic EIE will aim criticism at pre-existing systems in a way that inevitably comes back to a moment of uplift because they want to establish new, better conditions for those around them.
Kanye doesn't do this. Even when the net result provides amusement for the public, he insists that he has grandiose significance as though the public simply fails to see his worth. He seems to possess an air of defensiveness that wouldn't be as pronounced if all of his negative publicity simply amounted to a massive scheme on his part. After all, wouldn't he expect it?
I'm not a mind reader, but I think that when he speaks about himself, his accomplishments, and what he views as his talents, he generally does so to convince others that he's on par with influential people like Steve Jobs, Shakespeare, Disney, etc. He seems earnest. More recently, compared himself to Donald Trump, claiming they are both "dragon energy." Here, he's likely being earnest because he and Trump in fact have some similar characteristics. They are both shock jocks who go against the grain of establishments and public opinion - in my view, both Se ego types.
When he makes statements about topics other than himself, I think he often does so because he feels that he has something profound to get off his chest. For example, when he claimed that "George Bush doesn't care about black people", he seemed to do so because he received bits of information that eventually culminated as this controversial conclusion with the help of Ni in the background.
Fe seems absent from all of this. People shit their pants when he speaks up because he contrasts with the emotional vibe in a way that pays no heed to the emotional context.
>Is it leading to something bigger?
Yes, it does lead to something bigger, but that doesn't mean he's Ni ego. Trump became POTUS through publicity but that doesn't mean he's Ni ego.
I don't want to distract you, so let's just get to the point - if Kanye was a beta with Ni ego, he would possess strong -Ni. Let's look at Gulenko's description of -Ni:
"-Ni = desire to bypass danger. They aim to avoid previously committed mistakes. In their groups, experience, skill, know-how, sophistication are highly valued. They feel confident in extreme situations. "
If Kanye wanted to bypass danger, wouldn't he avoid making public statements that make people question his judgment? Furthermore, if he wanted to avoid previously committed mistakes, wouldn't he mix things up more to lead people away from the thought that he's an idiot? The Ni ego types I know operate with a mind-boggling level of discretion, and I don't see that with Kanye.
>Does he intentionally want to generate publicity?
I think he likes attention, which undermines the discretion Ni ego types tend to value.
>Does he believe it's going to further an ideal that he has? Is it for himself? Is it truly outwards?
This depends on how you define "ideal." At this stage, it's hard not to think he has a vision for success, but in my view, he has primarily wanted to service his own ego. He even made a song about his ego trips and life in the public eye:
To be fair, considering his mom's death, West has some scars of personal tragedy mixed up in his behavior. Ie. he has self-destructive tendencies, perhaps characteristic of someone with survivor's guilt or simply loss. But still, he looks like an Fi lead gamma to me.
I'm not in a good space today so my reply isn't going to be accurate unfortunately
"Fe seems absent from all of this. People shit their pants when he speaks up because he contrasts with the emotional vibe in a way that pays no heed to the emotional context." - absolutely not
"Fe leads are the kinds of people who, when they want beneficial results for their team, they will make the environment positive enough for a project to push forward. Even the negativistic EIE will aim criticism at pre-existing systems in a way that inevitably comes back to a moment of uplift because they want to establish new, better conditions for those around them." - He does exactly this?
"-Ni = desire to bypass danger. They aim to avoid previously committed mistakes. In their groups, experience, skill, know-how, sophistication are highly valued. They feel confident in extreme situations. " - Yeah bypass danger not bypass something else, I just think he knows he needs the courage in dangerous situations and he has it. The last 2 lines though you don't think that applies to him more than any other rapper?
I'll reply properly after, you do make some good points though but some of your points don't really link up to everything.
Don't worry about it.
Expound."Fe seems absent from all of this. People shit their pants when he speaks up because he contrasts with the emotional vibe in a way that pays no heed to the emotional context." - absolutely not
If he did then it should come as no surprise to him when people view him as a joke. He would have accepted the risks of behaving like a shock jock as part of the plan to sacrifice his image in the public eye."Fe leads are the kinds of people who, when they want beneficial results for their team, they will make the environment positive enough for a project to push forward. Even the negativistic EIE will aim criticism at pre-existing systems in a way that inevitably comes back to a moment of uplift because they want to establish new, better conditions for those around them." - He does exactly this?
I mean, when he jumped on stage at the VMAs, do you think that was part of a vision to do what I described? In my view, it didn't have anything to do with the vibes of feeling there. The way Fe ego types tend to influence the environment has a more incremental quality to it because it riffs off what it perceives. Kanye's influence has a much more extreme quality because it comes from deep seated feelings.
I don't think he feels "Ni confident" in extreme situations; if he was, then he wouldn't need to nourish his ego and act so self-destructively. He generally doesn't strike me as confident. He behaves this way out of insecurity. But I personally have respect for him for his honesty"-Ni = desire to bypass danger. They aim to avoid previously committed mistakes. In their groups, experience, skill, know-how, sophistication are highly valued. They feel confident in extreme situations. " - Yeah bypass danger not bypass something else, I just think he knows he needs the courage in dangerous situations and he has it. The last 2 lines though you don't think that applies to him more than any other rapper?
No rush. You make some good points, too.I'll reply properly after, you do make some good points though but some of your points don't really link up to everything.
SEE-Fi
Was watching this morning because I think he’s hilarious, and it just really struck me as being so , in particular. I could honestly see him as ESI, too, but he seems EP to me, heavy on the Fi.
ESI cp6w7
We are the same sociotype that's for sure.
4w3
Why even be prejudiced or have negative assumptions in the first place?
I would also like to point out that he has known to prefer to work on multiple projects instead of 1 and that he enjoys the discovery and creativity behind it(strong socio Ne), for example in 2005 he worked on Late Registration and Be. Last year he worked on Daytona, Nasir, etc. This is NOT indicative of weak socio Ne.
I search what people on this forum would type Kanye as after watching an interview with him. I knew most would say SEE before I even looked. ESFps (not all but most) are incredibly smooth, they rarely make things awkward. They are likely to humorously comment on the elephant in the room not BE the elephant in the room, and if they are the elephant in the room they will direct the humor on themselves. An SEE would be like an insult comic where even the guy getting roasted isn't mad. Black people especially rappers get typed as Se doms when they aren't.
Introverted irrationals have a doe-eyed look, they look like little babies. Se doms look like they are rapeing you with their eyes.
Yeah SE seem to have those big hunter eyes...."cause I don't wanna miss a thing...."
I have the same as Kanye, but I'm typing NE atm (but always open to suggestions)
SE ego is quite a strange typing for him though...
Kanye and Kim - SEE
I watched the vid at the top of the page for 25 mins, and got IEI
Aside from Features of behaviour matching with IEI, I couple of things I noted were:
Career motivations:
self expression
not money
admiration from peers
to tell the truth about life/no false image
He can't be anything other than merry, he's so blatantly fe valuing. Now past that I'm not sure though. I would guess Alpha NT? ILE ti sub?
kanye west is an interesting dude i mean he doenst seem low energy to me the dude is always ranting,trying to amp up the atmosphere,starting conflicts. My first guess was actually IEE-Fi if we use subtypes. but i also thought SEE? but he seems way to ranty,Ne for an Esfp plus i agree that Esfp's maybe a little more smoother,suave? (not always the case tho). He has a lot,lot of Ne but i also think a large quite of Se
I guess i can see ESI-Se but don't know how Ne polr is gonna work for him
Last edited by Sinister12; 04-26-2020 at 09:27 PM.
Kanye Se is weak, he's very vision focused and doesn't really focus on realistically thinking about the present. Strong Ne based on his beat selections and career choices throughout his career.
If you watch a lot of interviews especially earlier, he has low energy especially compared to other rappers(compare Kanye to Dipset or Tyler the Creator) . Those rants are just passion.
He's definitely a Fe valuer
Kanye west doesn’t even VI like an EIE lol, he’s ESI-Se mans is definitely an Fi dom I’m sorry but I can’t see how anybody says he’s an Fe valuer with all the stunts he pulls. Also seems like he’s broken,hurt he has cried in a lot of interviews definitely some things hurting him
ESI; same type as my dad
I think that Kanye West could be ESI-Se, but @Desert Financial has some incredibly faulty reasoning. I think I would've been more likely to start a thread title with a question about that stuff if I wasn't sure though sometimes I make mistakes with things I say I don't usually stand by them. Maybe Desert Financial doesn't stand by his or her mistakes either.
@sbbds when her user name was @niffer was imprecise when she said something like people couldn't be in relationships without morality.
I was hesitant to try and think I may have done the wrong thing with mention tags, I totally suck with GUIs, I need some help with that and that doesn't make my body feel bad. I know @sbbds is good with it, I love how/that she posted her five factor model results as they appeared on the web page she received her results and I was unhappy about how mine looked because of aesthetics.
I couldn't do it as well as her. I've always loved computers (because of video games at first and because they looked so good and was a new thing in my household and i figured there was a lot of potential with them) and never thought males were better with computers than females and I see that more and more as time goes on, it actually makes me kind of horny, it makes my body feel good and I'm glad. Although at times also makes me feel racially inferior and more masculine then I'd like to feel, but that's what therapies are for and I vastly like better women better who are good with tools and tech and w/o inelegantly demanding peoples' attention try to demonstrate to everyone into thinking their abilities with them are the best like EIE have... i find it much more lovely and sexy when ILE-Ti (or even SLE but to a lesser extent than when ILE-Ti do it) demonstrate or talk about their abilities.
I mean, EIE have harassed me about their abilities and my lack of them and when you read Dr. David Duke's My Awakening, he just loves to go on and on about his abilities with tools and computers and about how black people could never be good with them; it was just so shitty, he didn't express much that his foresight could be wrong.
Last edited by Disturbed; 02-20-2021 at 07:48 PM.
I'm sorry, but I'm psychologically disturbed.
He’s really dramatic and emote too much but says basically nothing. EIE. He puts on an act every time, doesn’t know how he feels about anything, internally not steady. He’s a case of EIE being with their dual, LSI Kim who gave him some stability but he eventually went off the rails. I guess she’s tired of putting up with his Fe bouncing around that she’s ok with divorce.
Kim is an SEE-N, Kanye EIE-C. he's probably a great example of an eccentric C-sub.
Kanye transcends type
Fi creative
I AM YOUR HOLY TOTEM
I AM YOUR SICK TABOO
RADICAL AND RADIANT
I'M YOUR NIGHTMARE COMING TRUE
I AM YOUR WORST ENEMY
I AM YOUR DEAREST FRIEND
MALIGNANTLY MALEVOLENT
I AM OF DIVINE DESCENT
I AM YOUR UNCONSCIOUSNESS
I AM UNRESTRAINED EXCESS
METAMORPHIC RESTLESSNESS
I'M YOUR UNEXPECTEDNESS
I AM YOUR APOCALYPSESTRAY BULLET
I AM YOUR BELIEF UNWROUGHT
MONOLITHIC JUGGERNAUT
FROM THE HEAVENS ABOVE
STRAY BULLET
READY OR NOT
I'M THE ILLEGITIMATE SON OF GOD
I’m always torn between SEE & EIE for him. He’s just such a drama Queen. But the thing is, is it more the bull in China shop kind, and the drama wasn’t exactly on purpose, just a consequence, or is all this calculated? He gives me the impression he is walking through life with jiggy buggs up his shirt, spinning around in manic narcissism. But I have a hard time believing he’d be as successful as he is if he wasn’t more calculative.
For example, he recently put Marilyn Manson on his Donda Album. And if you follow the news, you’d know MM is kinda in hot water right now & being chased with pitchforks by the canceling brigade, so he’s a pretty controversial person to put on there right now, Is he reaching out a hand to a sinking ship in a comrade Fi way or is he doing it for Fe shock?
https://www.thedailybeast.com/marily...-donda-feature
Still kinda leaning SEE, but yeah, not completely decided…
Last edited by Aster; 09-04-2021 at 12:19 PM.
Him pre-fame:
He reminds me of my teenage self if I had zero filter/inhibitions and unshakable confidence.
Last edited by Averroes; 04-13-2022 at 03:03 PM.
if he is SEE i am SEE
https://linktr.ee/tehhnicus
Jesus is King stops black magic and closes portals
self diagnosed ASD, ADHD, schizotypal/affective
Your face makes your brain and sociotype – how muscle use shapes personality
I want to care
if I was better I’d help you
if I was better you’d be better
Human Design 2/4 projector life path 1
I think SEE- he's really funny and Fe in a lot of his songs but is using it more in a demo way, in interviews it comes off a lot more Fi. I think it's common 'to look backwards' onto previous quadras for lots of creative inspiration. So it can seem Fe valuing when it isn't. He's inspired by the ghetto fabulousness of Betas, but is marketing and using it in a Gamma way. It's not all that hard to use a strong but unvalued function when writing something.
I really like the Gold digger song btw hehe. Some of those lines are so hilarious and on point and he dishes out real ness. Now I want Lolita to scream at me and say the reason I like it is cuz he's my mirror.
I now think he's an IEI